Tis the season of throwing s#$% against the wall
We're picking up very credible indications that Kirk Cousins is planning a potential move of his family from Minnesota to Atlanta. https://t.co/ZSlTq9tnMc
— ProFootballTalk (@ProFootballTalk) March 5, 2024
You're only given a little spark of madness. You mustn't lose it. — Robin Williams
I don’t understand that vitriol. Firstly, if I was Cousins, I would certainly
at least hear out all the offers that are on the table. The people who think he should have signed
with the Vikings without seeing what other options are out there are just plain
nuts. If someone comes in and offers
another $40M guaranteed above what the Vikings are offering, how many people
are going to say no? Regarding team
friendly deals … Almost no one is taking team friendly deals. A couple million here or there to be on the
team you want … sure … call that a team friendly deal if you want. But who’s leaving $10M+ on the table? Almost no one is turning down big contracts
to help the team. Did one guy take
less? Sure, but to hold that against
Kirk is ridiculous. Everyone is taking
the money.
@"JR44" said: Atlanta just makes too much sense for Kirk considering the factors, if Atlanta is really interested and not just positioning for a Fields trade, I would say it is the most likely where he ends upConsider family has always been far and away the number one priority for Kirk, his wife is from the Atlanta area and her parents still live there, Kirk's long time trainer since 2010 is in Atlanta, Kirk's parents are in Florida, where Kirk has spent a good part of the off seasons.
Russell Wilson's wife lived in Atlanta for a time and Justin Fields grew up in Georgia and attended Georgia for one year. Just sayin...
If they sign any of these 3 (including Kirk) it'll be billed as a "homecoming" of sorts.
I think the appeal of Atlanta for Kirk, aside from $, is the lack of a QB successor on the roster. I assume wherever he signs, he'll want some assurance that QB won't be the first round pick in 2024. That's a big ask but maybe one ATL will grant.
@"pattersaur" said:@"JR44" said: Atlanta just makes too much sense for Kirk considering the factors, if Atlanta is really interested and not just positioning for a Fields trade, I would say it is the most likely where he ends upConsider family has always been far and away the number one priority for Kirk, his wife is from the Atlanta area and her parents still live there, Kirk's long time trainer since 2010 is in Atlanta, Kirk's parents are in Florida, where Kirk has spent a good part of the off seasons.
Russell Wilson's wife lived in Atlanta for a time and Justin Fields grew up in Georgia and attended Georgia for one year. Just sayin...
If they sign any of these 3 (including Kirk) it'll be billed as a "homecoming" of sorts.
I think the appeal of Atlanta for Kirk, aside from $, is the lack of a QB successor on the roster. I assume wherever he signs, he'll want some assurance that QB won't be the first round pick in 2024. That's a big ask but maybe one ATL will grant.
I doubt any team would ever let a QB dictate who they draft. But if Atlanta signs Cousins you can rest assured they won't use the 8th pick on a QB.
I don’t think Kirk is going to say no to a draft qb, but I
could see him strongly asking for a better OLine or enough weapons before
signing. Russell on the other hand, I
could definitely see him becoming a problem if the team has a contingency plan.
@"medaille" said: I don’t think Kirk is going to say no to a draft qb, but I could see him strongly asking for a better OLine or enough weapons before signing. Russell on the other hand, I could definitely see him becoming a problem if the team has a contingency plan.
This entered my mind as well. It's kind of an awkward situation if you have, say, Russell Wilson and Drake Maye. This is why I'm convinced that if the Vikings fail to sign Cousins, they will, almost immediately, sell the farm for a top 3 or 4 pick.
Because once they've secured that pick, the bridge is more likely to be someone like a Darnold or a Minshew than a Wilson or a Mayfield. Vikings may even decide at that point that 4-pick Nick is a tolerable bridge.
@"MaroonBells" said:@"medaille" said: I don’t think Kirk is going to say no to a draft qb, but I could see him strongly asking for a better OLine or enough weapons before signing. Russell on the other hand, I could definitely see him becoming a problem if the team has a contingency plan.
This entered my mind as well. It's kind of an awkward situation if you have, say, Russell Wilson and Drake Maye. This is why I'm convinced that if the Vikings fail to sign Cousins, they will, almost immediately, sell the farm for a top 3 or 4 pick.Because once they've secured that pick, the bridge is more likely to be someone like a Darnold or a Minshew than a Wilson or a Mayfield. Vikings may even decide at that point that 4-pick Nick is a tolerable bridge.
I absolutely hate the "sell the farm" strategy. Do we need a young QB? Yes! Could we double fuck ourselves by "selling the farm" and still having said quarterback turn out to be a bust? Yes! Has the competitive rebuild strategy put us in a situation where we might have to sell the farm? Yes! Say what you will, but would anyone here have not ditched the competitive rebuild strategy and shallow results of last season to have an outright top pick this season without having to sell the farm? I think 99% would say yes
I think anyway you slice it, and whether Kirk returns or not, it is clear to me that Kwesi has put the Vikings in a very bad position. We have a roster with good talent and the potential to lock in some key players (Hunter, JJ). At the same time we have given all the leverage to our soon-to-be free agent QB. We don't realistically have the option to sign him if he reaches free agency because of the dead cap hit and we have put ourselves in a position where Cousins logically will want to explore free agency. We have no backup QB plan in house and we would need to mortgage the future by way of a massive draft haul in order to move up to get one of the top QB prospects in the draft. We could sign a Baker or a Donald or a Wilson and win 6-8 games -- enough to keep us out of contention for a top QB in next year's draft. If there was a plan, it sure has not come together...
@"MaroonBells" said:@"medaille" said: I don’t think Kirk is going to say no to a draft qb, but I could see him strongly asking for a better OLine or enough weapons before signing. Russell on the other hand, I could definitely see him becoming a problem if the team has a contingency plan.
This entered my mind as well. It's kind of an awkward situation if you have, say, Russell Wilson and Drake Maye. This is why I'm convinced that if the Vikings fail to sign Cousins, they will, almost immediately, sell the farm for a top 3 or 4 pick.Because once they've secured that pick, the bridge is more likely to be someone like a Darnold or a Minshew than a Wilson or a Mayfield. Vikings may even decide at that point that 4-pick Nick is a tolerable bridge.
I guess I don't see it that way. I'm not sure that everyone is as sold on the top QB (Williams) being heads and shoulders above the supposed 3th and 4th QB's following the combine, and it might get even more muddled after private workouts/interviews. I think there are plenty of varying opinions on Williams, May, McCarthy, Pennix, and Nix.If Atlanta does land Cousins, I certainly wouldn't move into the top 4 for any of them as I think they all have roughly the same potential boom or bust factor, and we're likely to land 1 of the top 3 or 4 QB's at our 11 spot which is about the same reward for standing pat. Not sure it affects who we pick up as a bridge QB. Think we get the best available regardless, and sign him to a 3 yr. deal. Again, if we let Cousins walk can we get Mayfield for less, while we have our QBOTF learn for 2-3 years?
@"Purpleblooded" said: I think anyway you slice it, and whether Kirk returns or not, it is clear to me that Kwesi has put the Vikings in a very bad position. We have a roster with good talent and the potential to lock in some key players (Hunter, JJ). At the same time we have given all the leverage to our soon-to-be free agent QB. We don't realistically have the option to sign him if he reaches free agency because of the dead cap hit and we have put ourselves in a position where Cousins logically will want to explore free agency. We have no backup QB plan in house and we would need to mortgage the future by way of a massive draft haul in order to move up to get one of the top QB prospects in the draft. We could sign a Baker or a Donald or a Wilson and win 6-8 games -- enough to keep us out of contention for a top QB in next year's draft. If there was a plan, it sure has not come together...I think Kwesi more than anybody realizes that running it back with Kirk will seal his fate. He wouldn't even get to serve out his 4th year as GM since all of our Cap will be going to an overpriced veteran QB with no money left to fill all the massive holes that exist all across this roster. It would be another 7-10 or 8-9 season. He even said it at the Combine. We don't have the roster depth we need. You don't bring back an expensive veteran QB unless you have the roster to contend like we did in 2018 when we originally signed him. They weren't close on a contract last season, and they are not close now.
JJM and keeping ‘25 and ‘26s 1sts is my choice. I think he’ll be there at 11.
I’d love to have Daniels but not by sacrificing 25 and 26 to do so. We could end up Carolina’ing ourselves.
I am wondering if there has been a shift in the plan whether it is by the Wilfs or KAM/KOC or both. I guess we'll see what happens
There’s absolutely no way Baker picks the Vikes over Tampa. Everyone else available ranges from complete scrub to 5-7 game winner.
If Kirk walks, they either throw a dart at one of the second-tier QBs and sign a shit-heap “transition” QB. Or they sell out for one of the better rookie options and see what he can do.
Option A likely lands the Vikes at the bottom of the division for the next 4+ years with a revolving door at QB. With option B, you at least find out what you’ve got sooner than plan A.
Either way, without Cousins, this front office will not survive without 100% nailing their first QB pick…and I’m talking it must be an absolute slam dunk “face of the franchise” Top 10 NFL QB. If this team turns into the Jets (which is a very real possibility)…. everyone gets fired.
5 starting vacancies on offense and on defense
He's 36 and blew out his achilles
28 in deadcap when he leaves (40 with Hunter and Davenport)
I get why he's leaving....
Were it 2009 or 2017, where the only thing missing is a veteran QB to set it off.Hell yeah, you absolutely bring him back/
The cupboard has bare spots .
He's gonna do motivational speeches until somebody beats the greatest comeback in NFL history record.
He's set.
@"Mattyman" said: 5 starting vacancies on offense and on defense He's 36 and blew out his achilles 28 in deadcap when he leaves (40 with Hunter and Davenport)I get why he's leaving....
Were it 2009 or 2017, where the only thing missing is a veteran QB to set it off.Hell yeah, you absolutely bring him back/
The cupboard has bare spots .
He's gonna do motivational speeches until somebody beats the greatest comeback in NFL history record.
He's set.
I wouldn't say 2017 qualifies as 1 QB away, we needed OL help in a bad way that year and that IMO was as much a problem as QB play. Case had that lucky horseshoe wedged up there just right and it would have likely stayed there if he hadn't gotten hit so damn much.
@"supafreak84" said:@"MaroonBells" said:@"medaille" said: I don’t think Kirk is going to say no to a draft qb, but I could see him strongly asking for a better OLine or enough weapons before signing. Russell on the other hand, I could definitely see him becoming a problem if the team has a contingency plan.
This entered my mind as well. It's kind of an awkward situation if you have, say, Russell Wilson and Drake Maye. This is why I'm convinced that if the Vikings fail to sign Cousins, they will, almost immediately, sell the farm for a top 3 or 4 pick.Because once they've secured that pick, the bridge is more likely to be someone like a Darnold or a Minshew than a Wilson or a Mayfield. Vikings may even decide at that point that 4-pick Nick is a tolerable bridge.
I absolutely hate the "sell the farm" strategy. Do we need a young QB? Yes! Could we double fuck ourselves by "selling the farm" and still having said quarterback turn out to be a bust? Yes! Has the competitive rebuild strategy put us in a situation where we might have to sell the farm? Yes! Say what you will, but would anyone here have not ditched the competitive rebuild strategy and shallow results of last season to have an outright top pick this season without having to sell the farm? I think 99% would say yes
The shallow results of last season were due in large part to one thing: Cousins injury. It’s all about the QB. If the Vikings hit on the QB they draft, they will have successfully, and competitively, rebuilt the franchise since taking over. Most of it happening last year.
But, yeah, that’s a BIG IF, and why I think they should do whatever it takes to keep Cousins. However, the Vikings still have the NFL’s best WR/WR/TE combo, two elite tackles and one of the NFL’s most improved defenses. They also have $40M in cap space this year and $140M in cap space next year to make it even better.
So at the end of the day, whether they earned a top 5 pick or pay for one makes little difference. Whatever future picks they give up in a trade can be replaced by free agents and they’ll have a shit ton of money to pay for them. So while you might envy the Bears, the Vikings are in a similar situation. The team who comes out on top will be the team who hits on their QB.
@"MaroonBells" said:@"supafreak84" said:@"MaroonBells" said:@"medaille" said: I don’t think Kirk is going to say no to a draft qb, but I could see him strongly asking for a better OLine or enough weapons before signing. Russell on the other hand, I could definitely see him becoming a problem if the team has a contingency plan.
This entered my mind as well. It's kind of an awkward situation if you have, say, Russell Wilson and Drake Maye. This is why I'm convinced that if the Vikings fail to sign Cousins, they will, almost immediately, sell the farm for a top 3 or 4 pick.Because once they've secured that pick, the bridge is more likely to be someone like a Darnold or a Minshew than a Wilson or a Mayfield. Vikings may even decide at that point that 4-pick Nick is a tolerable bridge.
I absolutely hate the "sell the farm" strategy. Do we need a young QB? Yes! Could we double fuck ourselves by "selling the farm" and still having said quarterback turn out to be a bust? Yes! Has the competitive rebuild strategy put us in a situation where we might have to sell the farm? Yes! Say what you will, but would anyone here have not ditched the competitive rebuild strategy and shallow results of last season to have an outright top pick this season without having to sell the farm? I think 99% would say yes
The shallow results of last season were due in large part to one thing: Cousins injury. It’s all about the QB. If the Vikings hit on the QB they draft, they will have successfully, and competitively, rebuilt the franchise since taking over. Most of it happening last year.
But, yeah, that’s a BIG IF, and why I think they should do whatever it takes to keep Cousins. However, the Vikings still have the NFL’s best WR/WR/TE combo, two elite tackles and one of the NFL’s most improved defenses. They also have $40M in cap space this year and $140M in cap space next year to make it even better.
So at the end of the day, whether they earned a top 5 pick or pay for one makes little difference. Whatever future picks they give up in a trade can be replaced by free agents and they’ll have a shit ton of money to pay for them. So while you might envy the Bears, the Vikings are in a similar situation. The team who comes out on top will be the team who hits on their QB.
I agree, with the big difference being having to potentially "sell the farm" to get the QB we want. We know the QB bust rate, so you double that potential negative impact by adding the package of future draft capital it would take to take that swing all so we can "competitively rebuild." It's just not a great strategy and not one that's worked out for us at this point
At this precise moment, I am relegating myself to facing another disappointing season.
@"CFIAvike" said: Either way, without Cousins, this front office will not survive without 100% nailing their first QB pick…and I’m talking it must be an absolute slam dunk “face of the franchise” Top 10 NFL QB. If this team turns into the Jets (which is a very real possibility)…. everyone gets fired.
I don’t think that’s true.
That’s only true if they draft one QB and sit on their thumbs waiting to
get fired. I think if you assume that’s
true, it’s also a safe assumption that they’d be fired for keeping Cousins and
also not going deep in the playoffs, which is not something Cousins has ever
done.
@"CFIAvike" said: Either way, without Cousins, this front office will not survive without 100% nailing their first QB pick…and I’m talking it must be an absolute slam dunk “face of the franchise” Top 10 NFL QB. If this team turns into the Jets (which is a very real possibility)…. everyone gets fired.
Nope, that's fan think.
@"medaille" said:@"CFIAvike" said: Either way, without Cousins, this front office will not survive without 100% nailing their first QB pick…and I’m talking it must be an absolute slam dunk “face of the franchise” Top 10 NFL QB. If this team turns into the Jets (which is a very real possibility)…. everyone gets fired.
I don’t think that’s true.
That’s only true if they draft one QB and sit on their thumbs waiting to
get fired. I think if you assume that’s
true, it’s also a safe assumption that they’d be fired for keeping Cousins and
also not going deep in the playoffs, which is not something Cousins has ever
done.
Scenario 1: We sell the farm to draft the QBOTF high in this draft. This QB is going to get 2-3 years to see if he pans out. If he busts, they traded away a ton of draft capital for crap. I would HIGHLY doubt the Wilf's would allow them to screw up again and everyone gets fired.Scenario 2: We employ a Goodwill-level QB to take over while we see if one of the second-tier QB's pans out in 1-3 years. Now it's possible other QB's are drafted in this time I suppose, but I can't see the Wilfs letting this experiment go for more than 2-3 years without firing everyone and letting a new regime try to get us a franchise QB.
In both scenarios...the only way this front office keeps the noose off their necks is to, again, 100% nail the first QB they pick. They either find the face of the franchise this year...or at absolute latest next year....or this whole FO and coaching staff are gone.
Edit Post (mod action — author will see a notice)
Warn Poster
Suspend User (3 days)
The user will be suspended for 3 days and will receive an email with the reason and information about how to appeal.