Dobbs hit his ceiling

@"CFIAvike" said: Honestly I know at this point we’re too far down the road to do it, but there really is no point to not starting Jaren Hall for the rest of the season once he’s cleared. The five wins in a row gave the season life and turned the playoffs into a realistic goal. If Kirk hasn’t gotten hurt, I think we could actually make a deep run and who knows at that point. 

I know…the marketing department did a wonderful job in painting Josh Dobbs a savior cemented by the two unlikely wins. But, seriously, Dobbs ain’t the guy. Tonight was everything Josh Dobbs will ever be…and that’s not enough. 

Tanking would be stupid at this point because they’ve already won too many games to get a great draft pick. Plus, all the passtrounaut bs has given the fanbase hope and you can’t realistically give up on that. 

I just think they need to find a way to transition back to Hall to see what they have. This holding onto the “competitive rebuild” masquerade they’re doing with Dobbs right now is doing more damage than it is benefit. 

2 threads, both borderline trolling, interesting 

@"Bullazin" said:

@"CFIAvike" said: Honestly I know at this point we’re too far down the road to do it, but there really is no point to not starting Jaren Hall for the rest of the season once he’s cleared. The five wins in a row gave the season life and turned the playoffs into a realistic goal. If Kirk hasn’t gotten hurt, I think we could actually make a deep run and who knows at that point. 

I know…the marketing department did a wonderful job in painting Josh Dobbs a savior cemented by the two unlikely wins. But, seriously, Dobbs ain’t the guy. Tonight was everything Josh Dobbs will ever be…and that’s not enough. 

Tanking would be stupid at this point because they’ve already won too many games to get a great draft pick. Plus, all the passtrounaut bs has given the fanbase hope and you can’t realistically give up on that. 

I just think they need to find a way to transition back to Hall to see what they have. This holding onto the “competitive rebuild” masquerade they’re doing with Dobbs right now is doing more damage than it is benefit. 

This take is as bad as your “ Dobbs is elite” after watching 2 series of play. 

2 threads, both borderline trolling, interesting 

This place whipsaws back and forth from pure elation to doom and gloom depending on a win or loss. 
This team is capable of beating any team out there, even with Dobbs!
It's a loss on the road against a team on a roll. I'm not discouraged by this game; just disappointed.
They are in a good position to make the playoffs, then see what happens.
There were plenty of mistakes to go around last night. But they didn't look like a team that sucks to me.
Premature to think about tanking or giving up.

@"jargomcfargo" said: This place whipsaws back and forth from pure elation to doom and gloom depending on a win or loss.  This team is capable of beating any team out there, even with Dobbs! It's a loss on the road against a team on a roll. I'm not discouraged by this game; just disappointed. They are in a good position to make the playoffs, then see what happens. There were plenty of mistakes to go around last night. But they didn't look like a team that sucks to me. Premature to think about tanking or giving up.

What'll tank the season is more injuries. 

hey.... the Vikings covered the spread though.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"pattersaur" said: Dobbs did hit his ceiling… and it was the first half of the Saints game.

Maybe this is a poor choice of words by OP but how can you say last night was his ceiling when he played so much better last week?

And as OP points out— we don’t have any other great options. I’m curious about Hall too but the odds he could’ve played any better than Dobbs did last night (even if he was healthy) seem low. Denver’s defense is very good and they took away almost all of the big plays, fake punt aside. Because of this, Addison was a ghost. They forced us into long drives and correctly guessed that eventually we’d turn the ball over, because it’s us.

The pass blocking got smoked quite a bit even though the run blocking was solid.

Dobbs is fine and I thought with a minute left we’d have a decent chance to get a FG try. Sadly that’s when they really dialed up the pressure and blew up what we wanted to do. It happens. We lost by 1 point to a good team in their house.

JJ would have made a huge difference I think and also Chandler should be playing firmly ahead of Mattison. That change needs to happen this week. To me our RB situation closely mirrors Buffalo’s. The difference is James Cook gets most of the touches for them, not Latavius Murray.

Denver and MN are pretty evenly matched teams. Neither are elite, but neither are bottom feeders either.  

JJ probably would have made a difference last night.  BUT - I have no idea how he and Dobbs will mesh (or not). I'm not convinced it'll work seamlessly. 

 How Mattison gets that many more carries than Chandler doesnt compute with me either. 

 

Mattison is much better at pass pro,  as was evidenced a couple times last night.  If Chandler was better a picking up a blitz it would be different,  but until then you have to keep Mattison on the field more IMO otherwise you are seriously tipping your hand which is already an issue.  I am starting to think Mattison may be tipping the run somewhat though,  seems like his runs get blown up more than AKers did,  or Chandler does,  that isnt on AM dancing or not running hard,  I think the D may be seeing something and taking advantage of it.  Or maybe its somebody else,  since Chandler has a few blown up as well,  but something seems off other than AM not being able to run the ball.

@"pattersaur" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"pattersaur" said: Dobbs did hit his ceiling… and it was the first half of the Saints game.

Maybe this is a poor choice of words by OP but how can you say last night was his ceiling when he played so much better last week?

And as OP points out— we don’t have any other great options. I’m curious about Hall too but the odds he could’ve played any better than Dobbs did last night (even if he was healthy) seem low. Denver’s defense is very good and they took away almost all of the big plays, fake punt aside. Because of this, Addison was a ghost. They forced us into long drives and correctly guessed that eventually we’d turn the ball over, because it’s us.

The pass blocking got smoked quite a bit even though the run blocking was solid.

Dobbs is fine and I thought with a minute left we’d have a decent chance to get a FG try. Sadly that’s when they really dialed up the pressure and blew up what we wanted to do. It happens. We lost by 1 point to a good team in their house.

JJ would have made a huge difference I think and also Chandler should be playing firmly ahead of Mattison. That change needs to happen this week. To me our RB situation closely mirrors Buffalo’s. The difference is James Cook gets most of the touches for them, not Latavius Murray.

Denver and MN are pretty evenly matched teams. Neither are elite, but neither are bottom feeders either.  

JJ probably would have made a difference last night.  BUT - I have no idea how he and Dobbs will mesh (or not). I'm not convinced it'll work seamlessly. 

 How Mattison gets that many more carries than Chandler doesnt compute with me either. 

 

Mattison is much better at pass pro,  as was evidenced a couple times last night.  If Chandler was better a picking up a blitz it would be different,  but until then you have to keep Mattison on the field more IMO otherwise you are seriously tipping your hand which is already an issue.  I am starting to think Mattison may be tipping the run somewhat though,  seems like his runs get blown up more than AKers did,  or Chandler does,  that isnt on AM dancing or not running hard,  I think the D may be seeing something and taking advantage of it.  Or maybe its somebody else,  since Chandler has a few blown up as well,  but something seems off other than AM not being able to run the ball.

Mr. Mattison is that you? Hah this seems charitable but you might be right. And Mattison did have some nice plays last night but the fumble killed. He also dropped the one target I remember him having. Play was going nowhere anyway but still. I’m not sure when exactly his hands calcified but good lord.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"pattersaur" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"purplefaithful" said:

@"pattersaur" said: Dobbs did hit his ceiling… and it was the first half of the Saints game.

Maybe this is a poor choice of words by OP but how can you say last night was his ceiling when he played so much better last week?

And as OP points out— we don’t have any other great options. I’m curious about Hall too but the odds he could’ve played any better than Dobbs did last night (even if he was healthy) seem low. Denver’s defense is very good and they took away almost all of the big plays, fake punt aside. Because of this, Addison was a ghost. They forced us into long drives and correctly guessed that eventually we’d turn the ball over, because it’s us.

The pass blocking got smoked quite a bit even though the run blocking was solid.

Dobbs is fine and I thought with a minute left we’d have a decent chance to get a FG try. Sadly that’s when they really dialed up the pressure and blew up what we wanted to do. It happens. We lost by 1 point to a good team in their house.

JJ would have made a huge difference I think and also Chandler should be playing firmly ahead of Mattison. That change needs to happen this week. To me our RB situation closely mirrors Buffalo’s. The difference is James Cook gets most of the touches for them, not Latavius Murray.

Denver and MN are pretty evenly matched teams. Neither are elite, but neither are bottom feeders either.  

JJ probably would have made a difference last night.  BUT - I have no idea how he and Dobbs will mesh (or not). I'm not convinced it'll work seamlessly. 

 How Mattison gets that many more carries than Chandler doesnt compute with me either. 

 

Mattison is much better at pass pro,  as was evidenced a couple times last night.  If Chandler was better a picking up a blitz it would be different,  but until then you have to keep Mattison on the field more IMO otherwise you are seriously tipping your hand which is already an issue.  I am starting to think Mattison may be tipping the run somewhat though,  seems like his runs get blown up more than AKers did,  or Chandler does,  that isnt on AM dancing or not running hard,  I think the D may be seeing something and taking advantage of it.  Or maybe its somebody else,  since Chandler has a few blown up as well,  but something seems off other than AM not being able to run the ball.

Mr. Mattison is that you? Hah this seems charitable but you might be right. And Mattison did have some nice plays last night but the fumble killed. He also dropped the one target I remember him having. Play was going nowhere anyway but still. I’m not sure when exactly his hands calcified but good lord.

Ha,  IIRC it was either him or Hock that had a drop that was likely the best result as it was going to be for a loss.  We needed to hit something down field last night to soften that D up,  even if it wasnt there,  DObbs needed to throw a few deep to keep the D honest.

Dobbs ball placement was consistently bad last night.  The "drops" by Hockenson were poorly thrown balls that gave the LB the opportunity to make a play.  You would not have seen that from Kirk.  Then there were a few WTF panic plays that could have cost us dearly.  Oh yeah, and he fumbled three times.  There is a lot to clean up.  KOC needs a better game plan.  Dobbs has had a few plays that looked like RPO but he never kept the ball -- could have been big plays.  After what Denver did late, expect lots of blitzing in the future -- up to KOC to put together a plan to exploit them.

I also thought Kene could have helped us last night with his speed.  A jet sweep; a toss play.  Mattison's stat line was decent, but honestly he killed us.

The offensive line played like crap didn't give Dobbs enough time to look for his 3rd or 4th read on many plays. The defense in the 2nd half seemed to play soft at times, too many 3 man rushes that did nothing.  Nobody had a good game and there was enough blame to go around.  

Dobbs didn't have a good game but other than the games he started for Arizona earlier this season he has never really played in any meaningful games so to say like the OP said that he has hit his ceiling how the hell do we know that.  

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"ThunderGod" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"TBro" said: Dobbs didn't have a crucial drive killing, game changing fumble. Dobbs didn't drop an interception in the end zone(Metellus) that would have taken 3 points off the board or provide loose coverage on Sutton in the end zone that forced Blackmon to come over and try to make a game saving pass breakup. Dobbs didn't revert the defense back into the Donashell for the Broncos Game Winning Drive where we played prevent and let Wilson get comfortable. It's only game 3 for him with no offseason to work with this staff and teammates. I still think that Dobbs allows us a chance to get off the Cousins Contract Prison we always find ourselves in. If we can sign Dobbs to a reasonable deal, we can use the savings to work on filling out this roster. Let him have a full offseason with KOC and let him compete with Hall and a soon to be drafted Rookie for the starting job in 2024. There is a reason we didn't sign Sign Cousins in the offseason with the contract he and his agent offered, there is a reason we drafted Hall, and there is a reason we signed Dobbs. Cousins, even with an injury discount, will still want too much money, and he doesn't fit the scheme that O'Connell wants to run with a mobile QB. 

I agree,   this changes nothing IMO on Cousins.  Dobbs ball placement was pretty shitty last night,  so this loss is not solely off his shoulders,  but as you say,  its week 3 is all,  just as people were to quick to jump in the hype,  they shouldn't be to quick to jump off that train.  IMO Dobbs gets the Bears game and if we don't see better ball placement there,  then be looking to Mullins or Hall.

Either way,  I dont see last night's loss as some sort of mandate that we should resign Cousins.

i agree with everything except playing Mullins.  We know Mullins.  They need to know more about if Dobbs and Hall can have a future with the Vikings.

Have we seen Mullins in live action with time to prepare with the ones when we arent running vanilla preseason schemes and not playing our starters.

@"AGRforever" said:

@"TBro" said:

@"AGRforever" said: Last night was by far Dobbs worst performance since showing up in MN.  It wasn’t even the ball placement. There were some legit very bad decisions. Not 50/50 balls. Just bad, rookie like decisions. 

We’ll see as the time goes on. Was Dobbs of the Saint first half the norm or Dobbs the second half Broncos?

Fun story though and I was entertained!!

. At least he won't take Tuesday's off like Cousins and will continue to put in the work with KOC to get better every week.

Really?  They don't have an eye roll emoji.....but really?
As for Dobbs, we got the guy for unloading Ezra Cleveland, who wasn't going to be on our team next year anyway.  A starting guard for a starting QB wasn't to bad when we had a guard to available to get rid of.  It was essentially a no risk trade in a desperate spot.  I actually got to watch some of the QB play yesterday.  League wide its atrocious.  Dobbs isn't going to light up the league by any means but he's pretty darn close to average or even above average compared to what I saw yesterday.  To have picked him up for nothing was when we did was a home run. 

We're not winning the Superbowl this year.  But its been entertaining to say the least. 

@"Greylock" said: The offensive line played like crap didn't give Dobbs enough time to look for his 3rd or 4th read on many plays. The defense in the 2nd half seemed to play soft at times, too many 3 man rushes that did nothing.  Nobody had a good game and there was enough blame to go around.  

Dobbs didn't have a good game but other than the games he started for Arizona earlier this season he has never really played in any meaningful games so to say like the OP said that he has hit his ceiling how the hell do we know that.  

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"ThunderGod" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"TBro" said: Dobbs didn't have a crucial drive killing, game changing fumble. Dobbs didn't drop an interception in the end zone(Metellus) that would have taken 3 points off the board or provide loose coverage on Sutton in the end zone that forced Blackmon to come over and try to make a game saving pass breakup. Dobbs didn't revert the defense back into the Donashell for the Broncos Game Winning Drive where we played prevent and let Wilson get comfortable. It's only game 3 for him with no offseason to work with this staff and teammates. I still think that Dobbs allows us a chance to get off the Cousins Contract Prison we always find ourselves in. If we can sign Dobbs to a reasonable deal, we can use the savings to work on filling out this roster. Let him have a full offseason with KOC and let him compete with Hall and a soon to be drafted Rookie for the starting job in 2024. There is a reason we didn't sign Sign Cousins in the offseason with the contract he and his agent offered, there is a reason we drafted Hall, and there is a reason we signed Dobbs. Cousins, even with an injury discount, will still want too much money, and he doesn't fit the scheme that O'Connell wants to run with a mobile QB. 

I agree,   this changes nothing IMO on Cousins.  Dobbs ball placement was pretty shitty last night,  so this loss is not solely off his shoulders,  but as you say,  its week 3 is all,  just as people were to quick to jump in the hype,  they shouldn't be to quick to jump off that train.  IMO Dobbs gets the Bears game and if we don't see better ball placement there,  then be looking to Mullins or Hall.

Either way,  I dont see last night's loss as some sort of mandate that we should resign Cousins.

i agree with everything except playing Mullins.  We know Mullins.  They need to know more about if Dobbs and Hall can have a future with the Vikings.

Have we seen Mullins in live action with time to prepare with the ones when we arent running vanilla preseason schemes and not playing our starters.

Mullins is a backup for a reason and if he had what it takes to run more than vanilla preseason schemes without starters he would be a starter somewhere else instead of sitting on the bench with a bad back.

@"Purpleblooded" said: Dobbs ball placement was consistently bad last night.  The "drops" by Hockenson were poorly thrown balls that gave the LB the opportunity to make a play.  You would not have seen that from Kirk.  Then there were a few WTF panic plays that could have cost us dearly.  Oh yeah, and he fumbled three times.  There is a lot to clean up.  KOC needs a better game plan.  Dobbs has had a few plays that looked like RPO but he never kept the ball -- could have been big plays.  After what Denver did late, expect lots of blitzing in the future -- up to KOC to put together a plan to exploit them.

I also thought Kene could have helped us last night with his speed.  A jet sweep; a toss play.  Mattison's stat line was decent, but honestly he killed us.

@"Greylock" said: The offensive line played like crap didn't give Dobbs enough time to look for his 3rd or 4th read on many plays. The defense in the 2nd half seemed to play soft at times, too many 3 man rushes that did nothing.  Nobody had a good game and there was enough blame to go around.  

Dobbs didn't have a good game but other than the games he started for Arizona earlier this season he has never really played in any meaningful games so to say like the OP said that he has hit his ceiling how the hell do we know that.  

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"ThunderGod" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"TBro" said: Dobbs didn't have a crucial drive killing, game changing fumble. Dobbs didn't drop an interception in the end zone(Metellus) that would have taken 3 points off the board or provide loose coverage on Sutton in the end zone that forced Blackmon to come over and try to make a game saving pass breakup. Dobbs didn't revert the defense back into the Donashell for the Broncos Game Winning Drive where we played prevent and let Wilson get comfortable. It's only game 3 for him with no offseason to work with this staff and teammates. I still think that Dobbs allows us a chance to get off the Cousins Contract Prison we always find ourselves in. If we can sign Dobbs to a reasonable deal, we can use the savings to work on filling out this roster. Let him have a full offseason with KOC and let him compete with Hall and a soon to be drafted Rookie for the starting job in 2024. There is a reason we didn't sign Sign Cousins in the offseason with the contract he and his agent offered, there is a reason we drafted Hall, and there is a reason we signed Dobbs. Cousins, even with an injury discount, will still want too much money, and he doesn't fit the scheme that O'Connell wants to run with a mobile QB. 

I agree,   this changes nothing IMO on Cousins.  Dobbs ball placement was pretty shitty last night,  so this loss is not solely off his shoulders,  but as you say,  its week 3 is all,  just as people were to quick to jump in the hype,  they shouldn't be to quick to jump off that train.  IMO Dobbs gets the Bears game and if we don't see better ball placement there,  then be looking to Mullins or Hall.

Either way,  I dont see last night's loss as some sort of mandate that we should resign Cousins.

i agree with everything except playing Mullins.  We know Mullins.  They need to know more about if Dobbs and Hall can have a future with the Vikings.

Have we seen Mullins in live action with time to prepare with the ones when we arent running vanilla preseason schemes and not playing our starters.

Mullins is a backup for a reason and if he had what it takes to run more than vanilla preseason schemes without starters he would be a starter somewhere else instead of sitting on the bench with a bad back.

@"Purpleblooded" said: Dobbs ball placement was consistently bad last night.  The "drops" by Hockenson were poorly thrown balls that gave the LB the opportunity to make a play.  You would not have seen that from Kirk.  Then there were a few WTF panic plays that could have cost us dearly.  Oh yeah, and he fumbled three times.  There is a lot to clean up.  KOC needs a better game plan.  Dobbs has had a few plays that looked like RPO but he never kept the ball -- could have been big plays.  After what Denver did late, expect lots of blitzing in the future -- up to KOC to put together a plan to exploit them.

I also thought Kene could have helped us last night with his speed.  A jet sweep; a toss play.  Mattison's stat line was decent, but honestly he killed us.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Greylock" said: The offensive line played like crap didn't give Dobbs enough time to look for his 3rd or 4th read on many plays. The defense in the 2nd half seemed to play soft at times, too many 3 man rushes that did nothing.  Nobody had a good game and there was enough blame to go around.  

Dobbs didn't have a good game but other than the games he started for Arizona earlier this season he has never really played in any meaningful games so to say like the OP said that he has hit his ceiling how the hell do we know that.  

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"ThunderGod" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"TBro" said: Dobbs didn't have a crucial drive killing, game changing fumble. Dobbs didn't drop an interception in the end zone(Metellus) that would have taken 3 points off the board or provide loose coverage on Sutton in the end zone that forced Blackmon to come over and try to make a game saving pass breakup. Dobbs didn't revert the defense back into the Donashell for the Broncos Game Winning Drive where we played prevent and let Wilson get comfortable. It's only game 3 for him with no offseason to work with this staff and teammates. I still think that Dobbs allows us a chance to get off the Cousins Contract Prison we always find ourselves in. If we can sign Dobbs to a reasonable deal, we can use the savings to work on filling out this roster. Let him have a full offseason with KOC and let him compete with Hall and a soon to be drafted Rookie for the starting job in 2024. There is a reason we didn't sign Sign Cousins in the offseason with the contract he and his agent offered, there is a reason we drafted Hall, and there is a reason we signed Dobbs. Cousins, even with an injury discount, will still want too much money, and he doesn't fit the scheme that O'Connell wants to run with a mobile QB. 

I agree,   this changes nothing IMO on Cousins.  Dobbs ball placement was pretty shitty last night,  so this loss is not solely off his shoulders,  but as you say,  its week 3 is all,  just as people were to quick to jump in the hype,  they shouldn't be to quick to jump off that train.  IMO Dobbs gets the Bears game and if we don't see better ball placement there,  then be looking to Mullins or Hall.

Either way,  I dont see last night's loss as some sort of mandate that we should resign Cousins.

i agree with everything except playing Mullins.  We know Mullins.  They need to know more about if Dobbs and Hall can have a future with the Vikings.

Have we seen Mullins in live action with time to prepare with the ones when we arent running vanilla preseason schemes and not playing our starters.

Mullins is a backup for a reason and if he had what it takes to run more than vanilla preseason schemes without starters he would be a starter somewhere else instead of sitting on the bench with a bad back.

Dobbs has been a career back up,  Cousins was a back up to RG3,  Brady was a back up,  Mahomes was a back up, lots of success stories start from the back up role.  I am not trying to advocate for Mullins,  but until a player gets a chance to showcase his skills,  he isnt likely going to get a chance to start elsewhere, to write him off simply because he is currently a back up is about as short sighted as the notion that we have seen Dobbs ceiling based on 3 weeks with the team.

I think the real Dobbs is somewhere between the Saints game and this game.  Let the BS hype die down, and let the dude play. Let's get JJ back and see how things progress.  I thought the line play last night took a step back as well.  I'm not sure how Kirk would have fared either.

I'm never happy with a loss, but if we had to lose one, this one wasn't so bad.  Bronco's are a good D, on the road, in prime time, and we lost by 1. 

@"Greylock" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Greylock" said: The offensive line played like crap didn't give Dobbs enough time to look for his 3rd or 4th read on many plays. The defense in the 2nd half seemed to play soft at times, too many 3 man rushes that did nothing.  Nobody had a good game and there was enough blame to go around.  

Dobbs didn't have a good game but other than the games he started for Arizona earlier this season he has never really played in any meaningful games so to say like the OP said that he has hit his ceiling how the hell do we know that.  

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"ThunderGod" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"TBro" said: Dobbs didn't have a crucial drive killing, game changing fumble. Dobbs didn't drop an interception in the end zone(Metellus) that would have taken 3 points off the board or provide loose coverage on Sutton in the end zone that forced Blackmon to come over and try to make a game saving pass breakup. Dobbs didn't revert the defense back into the Donashell for the Broncos Game Winning Drive where we played prevent and let Wilson get comfortable. It's only game 3 for him with no offseason to work with this staff and teammates. I still think that Dobbs allows us a chance to get off the Cousins Contract Prison we always find ourselves in. If we can sign Dobbs to a reasonable deal, we can use the savings to work on filling out this roster. Let him have a full offseason with KOC and let him compete with Hall and a soon to be drafted Rookie for the starting job in 2024. There is a reason we didn't sign Sign Cousins in the offseason with the contract he and his agent offered, there is a reason we drafted Hall, and there is a reason we signed Dobbs. Cousins, even with an injury discount, will still want too much money, and he doesn't fit the scheme that O'Connell wants to run with a mobile QB. 

I agree,   this changes nothing IMO on Cousins.  Dobbs ball placement was pretty shitty last night,  so this loss is not solely off his shoulders,  but as you say,  its week 3 is all,  just as people were to quick to jump in the hype,  they shouldn't be to quick to jump off that train.  IMO Dobbs gets the Bears game and if we don't see better ball placement there,  then be looking to Mullins or Hall.

Either way,  I dont see last night's loss as some sort of mandate that we should resign Cousins.

i agree with everything except playing Mullins.  We know Mullins.  They need to know more about if Dobbs and Hall can have a future with the Vikings.

Have we seen Mullins in live action with time to prepare with the ones when we arent running vanilla preseason schemes and not playing our starters.

Mullins is a backup for a reason and if he had what it takes to run more than vanilla preseason schemes without starters he would be a starter somewhere else instead of sitting on the bench with a bad back.

Dobbs has been a career back up,  Cousins was a back up to RG3,  Brady was a back up,  Mahomes was a back up, lots of success stories start from the back up role.  I am not trying to advocate for Mullins,  but until a player gets a chance to showcase his skills,  he isnt likely going to get a chance to start elsewhere, to write him off simply because he is currently a back up is about as short sighted as the notion that we have seen Dobbs ceiling based on 3 weeks with the team.

Then wouldn't that same logic apply to Dobbs as a backup finally getting a chance to showcase his skills?  Not saying Dobbs is the answer lets not write him off because he has been a backup to this point in his career.  I'm not saying your writing him off but maybe a slightly longer leash is needed based on his limited time with the team and without his number one receiver to this point.

@"Greylock" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Greylock" said: The offensive line played like crap didn't give Dobbs enough time to look for his 3rd or 4th read on many plays. The defense in the 2nd half seemed to play soft at times, too many 3 man rushes that did nothing.  Nobody had a good game and there was enough blame to go around.  

Dobbs didn't have a good game but other than the games he started for Arizona earlier this season he has never really played in any meaningful games so to say like the OP said that he has hit his ceiling how the hell do we know that.  

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"ThunderGod" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"TBro" said: Dobbs didn't have a crucial drive killing, game changing fumble. Dobbs didn't drop an interception in the end zone(Metellus) that would have taken 3 points off the board or provide loose coverage on Sutton in the end zone that forced Blackmon to come over and try to make a game saving pass breakup. Dobbs didn't revert the defense back into the Donashell for the Broncos Game Winning Drive where we played prevent and let Wilson get comfortable. It's only game 3 for him with no offseason to work with this staff and teammates. I still think that Dobbs allows us a chance to get off the Cousins Contract Prison we always find ourselves in. If we can sign Dobbs to a reasonable deal, we can use the savings to work on filling out this roster. Let him have a full offseason with KOC and let him compete with Hall and a soon to be drafted Rookie for the starting job in 2024. There is a reason we didn't sign Sign Cousins in the offseason with the contract he and his agent offered, there is a reason we drafted Hall, and there is a reason we signed Dobbs. Cousins, even with an injury discount, will still want too much money, and he doesn't fit the scheme that O'Connell wants to run with a mobile QB. 

I agree,   this changes nothing IMO on Cousins.  Dobbs ball placement was pretty shitty last night,  so this loss is not solely off his shoulders,  but as you say,  its week 3 is all,  just as people were to quick to jump in the hype,  they shouldn't be to quick to jump off that train.  IMO Dobbs gets the Bears game and if we don't see better ball placement there,  then be looking to Mullins or Hall.

Either way,  I dont see last night's loss as some sort of mandate that we should resign Cousins.

i agree with everything except playing Mullins.  We know Mullins.  They need to know more about if Dobbs and Hall can have a future with the Vikings.

Have we seen Mullins in live action with time to prepare with the ones when we arent running vanilla preseason schemes and not playing our starters.

Mullins is a backup for a reason and if he had what it takes to run more than vanilla preseason schemes without starters he would be a starter somewhere else instead of sitting on the bench with a bad back.

Dobbs has been a career back up,  Cousins was a back up to RG3,  Brady was a back up,  Mahomes was a back up, lots of success stories start from the back up role.  I am not trying to advocate for Mullins,  but until a player gets a chance to showcase his skills,  he isnt likely going to get a chance to start elsewhere, to write him off simply because he is currently a back up is about as short sighted as the notion that we have seen Dobbs ceiling based on 3 weeks with the team.

Then wouldn't that same logic apply to Dobbs as a backup finally getting a chance to showcase his skills?  Not saying Dobbs is the answer lets not write him off because he has been a backup to this point in his career.  I'm not saying your writing him off but maybe a slightly longer leash is needed based on his limited time with the team and without his number one receiver to this point.

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Greylock" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"Greylock" said: The offensive line played like crap didn't give Dobbs enough time to look for his 3rd or 4th read on many plays. The defense in the 2nd half seemed to play soft at times, too many 3 man rushes that did nothing.  Nobody had a good game and there was enough blame to go around.  

Dobbs didn't have a good game but other than the games he started for Arizona earlier this season he has never really played in any meaningful games so to say like the OP said that he has hit his ceiling how the hell do we know that.  

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"ThunderGod" said:

@"JimmyinSD" said:

@"TBro" said: Dobbs didn't have a crucial drive killing, game changing fumble. Dobbs didn't drop an interception in the end zone(Metellus) that would have taken 3 points off the board or provide loose coverage on Sutton in the end zone that forced Blackmon to come over and try to make a game saving pass breakup. Dobbs didn't revert the defense back into the Donashell for the Broncos Game Winning Drive where we played prevent and let Wilson get comfortable. It's only game 3 for him with no offseason to work with this staff and teammates. I still think that Dobbs allows us a chance to get off the Cousins Contract Prison we always find ourselves in. If we can sign Dobbs to a reasonable deal, we can use the savings to work on filling out this roster. Let him have a full offseason with KOC and let him compete with Hall and a soon to be drafted Rookie for the starting job in 2024. There is a reason we didn't sign Sign Cousins in the offseason with the contract he and his agent offered, there is a reason we drafted Hall, and there is a reason we signed Dobbs. Cousins, even with an injury discount, will still want too much money, and he doesn't fit the scheme that O'Connell wants to run with a mobile QB. 

I agree,   this changes nothing IMO on Cousins.  Dobbs ball placement was pretty shitty last night,  so this loss is not solely off his shoulders,  but as you say,  its week 3 is all,  just as people were to quick to jump in the hype,  they shouldn't be to quick to jump off that train.  IMO Dobbs gets the Bears game and if we don't see better ball placement there,  then be looking to Mullins or Hall.

Either way,  I dont see last night's loss as some sort of mandate that we should resign Cousins.

i agree with everything except playing Mullins.  We know Mullins.  They need to know more about if Dobbs and Hall can have a future with the Vikings.

Have we seen Mullins in live action with time to prepare with the ones when we arent running vanilla preseason schemes and not playing our starters.

Mullins is a backup for a reason and if he had what it takes to run more than vanilla preseason schemes without starters he would be a starter somewhere else instead of sitting on the bench with a bad back.

Dobbs has been a career back up,  Cousins was a back up to RG3,  Brady was a back up,  Mahomes was a back up, lots of success stories start from the back up role.  I am not trying to advocate for Mullins,  but until a player gets a chance to showcase his skills,  he isnt likely going to get a chance to start elsewhere, to write him off simply because he is currently a back up is about as short sighted as the notion that we have seen Dobbs ceiling based on 3 weeks with the team.

Then wouldn't that same logic apply to Dobbs as a backup finally getting a chance to showcase his skills?  Not saying Dobbs is the answer lets not write him off because he has been a backup to this point in his career.  I'm not saying your writing him off but maybe a slightly longer leash is needed based on his limited time with the team and without his number one receiver to this point.

who is writing him off?  I have defended Dobbs,   all I have said is if after the Bears game we dont see an improvement in ball placement and a few other issues he needs to clean up then I wouldnt mind seeing what Hall or Mullins has to offer.  There are only so many games left this year,  and if we really are moving on from Kirk,  then we need to know what we have in the other 2.  I already think Dobbs would likely be worth another contract ( prove it type deal that is incentive laden.)