Keeping JJM will be a business decision
After listening to all the pundits say why we will re-sign Darnold on a Franchise tag, sign him to a 4-year deal, blah blah ad nauseum, and why we will trade JJM and nobody knows what to do with Daniel Jones...I think I can reasonably forecast what will actually happen in the end.
It's going to be a business decision (just like letting Cousins walk, which worked out pretty well for us). After trying to make it complicated, I realized it's not that complicated.
You're going to tie up around $41 million to secure Darnold for one year on a franchise tag, or between $35-$40 million/year on a 3-4 year deal.
You have maybe $50-70 million (depending on who is calculating what) in salary cap room.
Do you tie up $40mm on one person? Or do you use that as capital to re-sign the FA's we badly want to keep, and go on the hunt for more help on both interior lines?
JJM's cap hit is team friendly this year and for a couple more years.
If they are serious about building a Championship calibre TEAM, it makes more sense to spread that salary cap around, not hamstring us into oblivion in future years by deferring cap hits (thanks Spielman). You've theoretically got say $35mm to spend on improving the roster, and that includes keeping JJM and signing Daniel Jones to a one year backup extension for say $5mm/year (while he attends QB Whisperer School with KOC).
One variation on that them would be the tag & trade option for Darnold. Franchise tag him and trade him to some QB desperate team. There are very few proven options out there and I'm certain that some teams would think they died and went to heaven if they could get Darnold for a bargain $41mm with the option of a long-term deal.
I'm impressed with some of the moves Kwesi has done to build this roster and get us out of cap hell that he inherited. It doesn't happen all at once. I think he learned from blowing the draft his first year, and he's a smart, shrewd guy. We are sitting with an embarrassment of riches in our QB room, and that give us leverage. Not one person thought we'd be in this situation 365 days ago.
purplefaithful wrote:
S. Salisbury was on with Barriero today....Probably more confirming vs anything news breaking.Loves JJM but doesnt believe they can hand the rook the keys to start the season, not w/out competition to win it.
Thinks the Vikings may try to ink Darnold to a 2 year at 15-18/year.
- Would not break the bank this year or future seasons.
- Buys JJM some additional time to learnLast two games have definitely cost Darnold $, but he wouldn't be shocked if someone offers him a 3 year + deal at bigger $ than the Vikings would pay.
I think there are several team who will be willing to offer Sam more money than the Vikings. Then the ball's in Sam's court. I just want to get something for him—to turn what we accomplished with him into some kind of draft capital.
If signing Sam to a 2-year deal, allowing the Vikings to trade him before year two, achieves that, I'm all for it. And the security it provides in terms of competition or a hedge against JJ's health is just a bonus.
StickierBuns wrote:
But learn what? He sat all year with his injury. Next step is to play. What's another year going to do sitting and watching? Two rookie QBs made the playoffs, why can't we hand JJM 'the keys'? This line of thinking just doesn't make sense to me. And why would Darnold sign a contract for $15 million? The whole thought by Salisbury is goofy to me, IMO. I get competition for JJ, but its not going to come from Darnold.
I agree, no benefit to JJM sitting on the bench yr2 watching instead of getting experience playing.
I dont think KOC will just hand the keys to him without a competition.
We'll see who they retain for competition, depth soon enough. FA isnt that far off.
MaroonBells wrote:
I think there are several team who will be willing to offer Sam more money than the Vikings. Then the ball's in Sam's court. I just want to get something for him—to turn what we accomplished with him into some kind of draft capital.
If signing Sam to a 2-year deal, allowing the Vikings to trade him before year two, achieves that, I'm all for it. And the security it provides in terms of competition or a hedge against JJ's health is just a bonus.
The meniscus doesnt worry me like an ACL or some other CL would...How they fill out the QB room is almost as interesting as the draft this year. Its all over the fan forums, #1 issue pondered.
Hurry-up Vikings, we ain't getting any younger!
purplefaithful wrote:
S. Salisbury was on with Barriero today....Probably more confirming vs anything news breaking.
Loves JJM but doesnt believe they can hand the rook the keys to start the season, not w/out competition to win it.
Thinks the Vikings may try to ink Darnold to a 2 year at 15-18/year.
- Would not break the bank this year or future seasons.
- Buys JJM some additional time to learn
Last two games have definitely cost Darnold $, but he wouldn't be shocked if someone offers him a 3 year + deal at bigger $ than the Vikings would pay.
But learn what? He sat all year with his injury. Next step is to play. What's another year going to do sitting and watching? Two rookie QBs made the playoffs, why can't we hand JJM 'the keys'? This line of thinking just doesn't make sense to me. And why would Darnold sign a contract for $15 million? The whole thought by Salisbury is goofy to me, IMO. I get competition for JJ, but its not going to come from Darnold.
JimmyinSD wrote:
I totally expect to get outbid for Jones ( will not call him by that stupid ass nickname, those need to be earned and he never looked worthy) and Darnold, however either of them on a 2 or 3 year deal at 15 to 18 per would be ok with me, as long as we have the ability to trade them and they only have limited trade block ability (IE: give them a couple options and let them pick between them if options are available) I do think JJM needs real competition, I think it will drive him even harder to be a better QB for us. I think every position should have competition, somebody get parker romo a contract please. and find me a punter...anybody, we need competition there as well.
The NYG are still on the hook for Jones contract next season. He doesn't necessarily have to chase the biggest offer. He may choose to reset his career in KOC's offense which if successful will enable him to command a bigger payday down the line.
JimmyinSD wrote:
I totally expect to get outbid for Jones ( will not call him by that stupid ass nickname, those need to be earned and he never looked worthy) and Darnold, however either of them on a 2 or 3 year deal at 15 to 18 per would be ok with me, as long as we have the ability to trade them and they only have limited trade block ability (IE: give them a couple options and let them pick between them if options are available) I do think JJM needs real competition, I think it will drive him even harder to be a better QB for us. I think every position should have competition, somebody get parker romo a contract please. and find me a punter...anybody, we need competition there as well.
Agree, I'm in the start JJM crowd but if you can get either Darnold or Jones for 2 years at that 15-18/yr range, I'd buy the insurance policy.
Knucklehead wrote:
The NYG are still on the hook for Jones contract next season. He doesn't necessarily have to chase the biggest offer. He may choose to reset his career in KOC's offense which if successful will enable him to command a bigger payday down the line.
Are they? Does Jones have offset language in his contract?
StickierBuns wrote:
I think this is 50/50 that Danny Dimes stays. Trust me, every year there'll be a need for a QB and going to the KOC School of Wayward QBs will only help Jones in 2026. And what team is going to sign him to start? Slim to none, but there's always X-factor situations and that's why I have it at only 50-50, it would be higher without the crazy owner factor somewhere else. But my guess would be that KOC is framing it as compete with JJM for the starting spot.
Watching Jones play, I haven't seen anything from him that would make me want him as a starter if I ran an NFL team. He's going to get a backup contract so probably will be just as good doing that under KOC/Vikings as he would be anywhere else. They have a relationship going back a ways. I think he will probably be here. Question is timing. If they signed him tomorrow that really sends a signal to Darnold and potential tag/trade partners that they don't need to give the Vikings anything to get Darnold.
People continute to write pure silliness about Darnold taking less to stay here or getting big money here, neither of which will happen. He will get the best payday of his career, whether that's 25, 30, 40 million or more (not likely imo but in this league who knows). But he won't be playing for Minnesota, it would wreck their cost control plan with JJM. Best bet for the Vikes is work with his agent and him if he's amenable to get something better than 2026 comp pick value which is essentially an early 4th that will be canceled by all the f.a. signings we do this offseason.
AGRforever wrote:
Are they? Does Jones have offset language in his contract?
Yes, the Giants are paying him next year. So, I don't think money is an issue for Jones. He turned down 2 teams last year that offered him to start for them to come here with KOC. I actually feel its more 75-25 that Jones stays and will be the QB that competes with JJ.
Jones renegotiated his contract last offseason, his 2025 contact was guaranteed for injury only.
That’s why they sat him & subsequently released him.
Canthony wrote:
Yes, the Giants are paying him next year. So, I don't think money is an issue for Jones. He turned down 2 teams last year that offered him to start for them to come here with KOC. I actually feel its more 75-25 that Jones stays and will be the QB that competes with JJ.
My gut feeling is I don't think this is true. Can you link to something stating this is position?
I've heard he had an offset for 2024, but I don't think there's anything like that for 2025, but I haven't looked that hard for it.
Knucklehead wrote:
The NYG are still on the hook for Jones contract next season. He doesn't necessarily have to chase the biggest offer. He may choose to reset his career in KOC's offense which if successful will enable him to command a bigger payday down the line.
That's interesting. I didn't know that. Makes a big difference.
medaille wrote:
My gut feeling is I don't think this is true. Can you link to something stating this is position?
I've heard he had an offset for 2024, but I don't think there's anything like that for 2025, but I haven't looked that hard for it.
I read up on the restructure. You are correct. They paid him the 22.1 million last year in the restructure it looks like. Kind of a goofy restructure deal if you ask me. Confusing. Either way, I don't think money will be his motivation in 2025
Knucklehead wrote:
The NYG are still on the hook for Jones contract next season. He doesn't necessarily have to chase the biggest offer. He may choose to reset his career in KOC's offense which if successful will enable him to command a bigger payday down the line.
I think this is 50/50 that Danny Dimes stays. Trust me, every year there'll be a need for a QB and going to the KOC School of Wayward QBs will only help Jones in 2026. And what team is going to sign him to start? Slim to none, but there's always X-factor situations and that's why I have it at only 50-50, it would be higher without the crazy owner factor somewhere else. But my guess would be that KOC is framing it as compete with JJM for the starting spot.
Doesn't make any difference to me. If you are going to spend more money on a QB to compete with JJM, it should be Darnold, not Jones. Jones isn't near the QB Darnold is. A QB competition between Jones and JJM isn't going to mean much. JJM will prevail. If not, the Vikings are in trouble!
Kentis wrote:
No, Jones is not owed, 2025 guaranteed for injury only, see my post above.
Correct. Per Tom Pelissaro:
Tom Pelissero
@TomPelissero
Some cap math ...
Daniel Jones was due $30.5 million in 2025 with a $41.605M cap number. But the #Giants owe him no more cash beyond this season if they release (or trade) him before March 16, when $12M of his $23M injury guarantee would convert to a full guarantee.
hogjowlsjohnny wrote:
Doesn't make any difference to me. If you are going to spend more money on a QB to compete with JJM, it should be Darnold, not Jones. Jones isn't near the QB Darnold is. A QB competition between Jones and JJM isn't going to mean much. JJM will prevail. If not, the Vikings are in trouble!
I disagree. I think Jones is much better between the ears and is just as talented.
Gink surprised me with the degree of impact he had, all 3 of the D FA's did.
Looks old enough to be JJ's uncle.
Hurry-up Vikings, we ain't getting any younger!
Doesn't it seem like this was set up by KOC? Hard to believe those two would just go to a game together. Maybe I am off. Ready to take over the reins, let's get you ready, kid.
McCarthy brought Uncle Andrew to drive and buy beer. Van Ginkel brought young JJ to help him score college girls.
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