JJM v Maye
From a DC's perspective
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As Gophers defensive coordinator last season, Joe Rossi faced Maye and McCarthy in a span of a month, which meant he studied hours of video of them and crafted game plans with their different skill sets in mind.
Rossi left to become defensive coordinator at Michigan State after the season. He took a break from spring practice this past week to share his insights into the two quarterbacks.
First up, Maye.
"I think he's super talented," Rossi said. "He's got very good arm talent. I thought he was accurate. He goes through his progressions really well. And he's more mobile than you think.
"If things aren't open, he'll move in the pocket to throw it. And then if it's still not open, he'll pull it down and run for five and run out of bounds and line up and play the next down. I appreciate that because hey, he's moving, he's extending plays, he's getting positive yardage, but then he's being smart with the ball and not taking hits."
Rossi was mindful of Maye's mobility as he constructed his game plan.
"We wanted to keep him in the pocket as much as possible when we rushed because we knew that he would get out," he said. "When he got out, he extended the play and then sometimes the coverage would break down. We wanted to him, but we also wanted to be aware of not giving him the opportunity to get escape lanes."
Maye lived up to the hype in a 31-13 win on Sept. 16, completing 29 of 40 passes for 414 yards and two touchdowns.
The Gophers intercepted Maye on back-to-back possessions in the first half. One was a poor decision and thrown under pressure. The other was an excellent play by defensive back Jack Henderson.
The Tar Heels converted 12 of 17 third-down opportunities, almost all of them coming on Maye's passing or scrambling.
"He did a good job of keeping the chains moving, getting first downs and kind of wearing us out a little bit," Rossi said.
McCarthy and Michigan visited Huntington Bank Stadium three weeks later.
The game was over before it started, with the Wolverines rolling to a 52-10 win on their way to a national championship.
Michigan's scheme limited McCarthy's profile as a passer. He averaged only 22 pass attempts per game and threw 93 fewer passes than Maye for the season despite playing in three additional postseason games. McCarthy completed 72.3% of his passes, the sixth-best rate nationally, with only four interceptions in 15 games.
"He did a really good job managing and distributing the ball," Rossi said. "He had playmakers everywhere, whether it was the tailbacks, the tight ends, the receivers. I thought he was really good off the run game in play-action and throwing over the top of defenses. He got us a couple times doing that.
"On third down, the thing we feared a ton was him running with the ball. He made a lot of plays with his feet, getting out of the pocket, long scrambles, moving the chains."
McCarthy attempted only 20 passes against the Gophers, completing 14 for 219 yards and a touchdown. He also had touchdown runs of 5 and 7 yards.
"If we would have got them into more passing situations and third down, we wanted to spy him because we felt like he was just really dangerous when he got outside the pocket," Rossi said.
The Vikings' quarterback research will be voluminous before draft night. If they asked Rossi for his perspective?
"After seeing both of them, watching them and game planning them, I think they're both first-round players," Rossi said. "If you're going to look to be more in the drop-back game and throw it, I think Maye has a little bit of an advantage there. If you're going to be more of a run-game, play-action, throw-the-ball-over-the-top , I think I would probably go the other way."
https://www.startribune.com/vikings-nfl-draft-quarterback-jj-mccarthy-drake-maye-gophers-joe-rossi-chip-scoggins/600356899/
Hurry-up Vikings, we ain't getting any younger!
purplefaithful wrote:
Unlike the rest of the QB's, where Penix and Nix end-up are such big questions marks...Brees dropped to the top of Round 2 in 2001 because of his 6-foot size and questions about whether his arm strength was tapped out. Now? He's a lock for the Hall of Fame in 2026. Nix, my fifth-ranked quarterback in this class, is a little taller at 6-2, but he has some of the same questions, especially coming from an Oregon offense that saw him throw quick and short. But when I watch Nix throw with precision, I see a lot of Brees' accuracy in him. -- Mel Kiper Jr., NFL draft analyst
Fucking kiper stealing my take, I had written a post 2 days ago about how I thought Nix reminded ME of Brees in a lot of his tape....but of course I didn't post it. Now the hair gets the credit.
Why isn't Chuck Foreman in the Hall of Fame?
I think ultimately, JJM will be the guy if the Vikings do trade up. I think the smokescreen about New England and Washington also liking him is meant to drive up their asking price for a team looking to move up. I feel like MN sees him as a close #2 option
I think Maye is actually the #1 guy they want but the cost is gonna be too big to jump to 3+ to get him. I think the best case scenario for Minnesota is that the “rumors” are actually true and a team in the top 3 does fall in love with JJM and allows Maye to slide.
I feel like they worked out Penix for over 100 throws because they really needed to see if he can even hack it. Penix is the “break glass in case of emergency” pick, IMO. If he gets picked, they will be disappointed (of course they won’t say that). And I can almost guarantee they’ll plan on being in the exact same position they are next season. Possibly looking to spend a huge chunk of that cap space on a free agent QB if one becomes available.
I don’t think Nix is even on their Radar
The only outlier I can’t figure out is Jayden Daniels. Did KAM trade for Dobbs last year because THAT’S actually the type of QB KOC wants or was that a strictly “GM move”? The only thing giving me pause here is that this is the only QB other than Williams they haven’t worked out. Either they just assume he’s going #2 or they’re trying to play poker to see if they can get him to slip.
CFIAvike wrote:
I think ultimately, JJM will be the guy if the Vikings do trade up. I think the smokescreen about New England and Washington also liking him is meant to drive up their asking price for a team looking to move up. I feel like MN sees him as a close #2 optionI think Maye is actually the #1 guy they want but the cost is gonna be too big to jump to 3+ to get him. I think the best case scenario for Minnesota is that the “rumors” are actually true and a team in the top 3 does fall in love with JJM and allows Maye to slide.
I feel like they worked out Penix for over 100 throws because they really needed to see if he can even hack it. Penix is the “break glass in case of emergency” pick, IMO. If he gets picked, they will be disappointed (of course they won’t say that). And I can almost guarantee they’ll plan on being in the exact same position they are next season. Possibly looking to spend a huge chunk of that cap space on a free agent QB if one becomes available.
I don’t think Nix is even on their Radar
The only outlier I can’t figure out is Jayden Daniels. Did KAM trade for Dobbs last year because THAT’S actually the type of QB KOC wants or was that a strictly “GM move”? The only thing giving me pause here is that this is the only QB other than Williams they haven’t worked out. Either they just assume he’s going #2 or they’re trying to play poker to see if they can get him to slip.
If we're to believe the tea leaves, this is accurate. In other words, the Vikings are either brilliant or clueless when it comes to disguising their intentions.
Regarding Daniels, remember to add Brissett. They reportedly wanted him and were declined before turning attention to Dobbs. Both are bigger, mobile QBs with requisite arm strength. But neither is the kind of runner Daniels is.
MaroonBells wrote:
If we're to believe the tea leaves, this is accurate. In other words, the Vikings are either brilliant or clueless when it comes to disguising their intentions.
Regarding Daniels, remember to add Brissett. They reportedly wanted him and were declined before turning attention to Dobbs. Both are bigger, mobile QBs with requisite arm strength. But neither is the kind of runner Daniels is.
They definitely had interest in Brissett. Just weren't going to give up a high draft pick to get him, he isn't worth that. KOC is on the record suggesting a QB who can threaten the defense with his legs is ideal. My only concern with Daniels is that although he has all the athletic ability in the world he doesn't avoid pressure all that well. If you start to watch his rushing plays the majority are him seeing an opening vs. escaping pressure, which NFL teams will be able to take away.
I still chuckle every time I see a mock draft online and it lists JJM's weight at 202 lbs, lol. He weighed 219 lbs at the Combine. He's strong and solid. He's got the athleticism, speed and arm strength to move out of or avoid many sacks or hard hits. He's going to get tagged some running, but he'll learn. He's got a build like Jordan Love.
Not that Kwesi listens to me, but hear me out.
Both Nix and Penex are now in the conversation about possible first round picks (and our hand might be forced at 11 since Denver and the Raiders are BOTH appearing to be serious about a QB, likely decreasing the possibility of picking one of those two guys at either 23 or later).
Group consensus now is that EVERY ONE of the top six QBs has holes and the assurances of trading up "to get our guy" rarely works...
Please Kwesi, if you would listen to me, DON'T mortgage our future by trying to move up.
Sit tight, you're in an awesome position with 11 and 23. This is a unique year with a half dozen QBs in the first round conversation.
Pick up an anchor to our IDL with #23. It appears that at least 3 of the top 4 IDL men will be still available.
Let all the pundits, fans, sportswriters theorize endlessly about packaging picks and trading up for one QB over another.
Keep playing poker with KOC and don't tip your hand until your pick at #11 comes up. Sit tight and don't get cute.
It's a compelling argument, but I'm just the opposite...
If (and only if) they got a guy leagues above the others? They trust their system and process?
Swing for the fences if you're the Vikings.
If they hit with a face of the franchise for the next 10 years? Nobody will give a hoot about a lost #1 pick in 25.
Hurry-up Vikings, we ain't getting any younger!
purplefaithful wrote:
It's a compelling argument, but I'm just the opposite...If (and only if) they got a guy leagues above the others? They trust their system and process?
Swing for the fences if you're the Vikings.
If they hit with a face of the franchise for the next 10 years? Nobody will give a hoot about a lost #1 pick in 25.
I get the argument. But I'm more with you on this one. To me it comes down to trusting your process. If all your film study and research tells you that there is very little difference between Maye, Mac, Nix and Penix, then sure, stay where you are.
But if all that research tells you there is one particular prospect who stands out, who fits this offense best, then go get that guy and if you need to add the '25 1st, so be it.
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